policy and delay which had been so often adopted by the Council.

Mr. QUAIN complained that on this and other occasions Sir William Gull was not so courteous as he might have been to the other members of Council.

Sir DOMINIC CORRIGAN thought, for the sake of consistency, the better course would be to introduce all the other bodies into the resolution, so that they might all be dealt with alike. The amendment was then put and lost by a majority of ten to eight. The motion was put and carried.

Dr. STORRAR gave notice of the following motion:-"That the duties to which the General Medical Council are appointed are defined by the Medical Acts, and the Council are of opinion that their appointments do not authorise them to represent to the Government the views of the profession on the large social question of the expediency or otherwise of admitting women to practise medicine."

Letters were read from Miss Jex-Blake and Mr. Arthur Norton with reference to the registration of women; and also a letter in reference to Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill from Dr. Shuttleworth, which letters were ordered to be entered on the programme.

The Council then adjourned.

"Medical Department, Privy Council Office, June 8, 1875. "Sir,-I am directed by the Lord President to request that, at the meeting now shortly to be held of the General Medical Council, you will have the goodness to bring under the consideration of that body the Bill which has been introduced in the House of Commons by Mr. CowperTemple to amend the Medical Act, 1858, so far as relates to the registration of women who have taken the degree of doctor of medicine in a foreign university,' and that you will move the Medical Council to favour his Grace with their observations upon it.

JOHN SIMON."

"It appears to the Lord President that Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill, though very limited in its direct scope, can hardly fail to raise in Parliament the general question whether women ought to be able to look to medical practice, or certain branches of it, as open to them equally with men as a profession and means of livelihood. And I am to say that, as Government may have to express an opinion on this general question, with regard, on the one hand, to women who desire to obtain legal status as medical practitioners in this country, and, on the other hand, to the examination rules, or conditions, which prevent them from accomplishing their wish, his Grace would be glad that the observations with which the Medical Council may favour him should not be restricted to the particular proposal of Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill, but should discuss, as fully as the Medical Council may see fit, the object to which that proposal would contribute. "I am, Sir, your obedient servant, "Dr. Acland, F.R.S., Oxford. (Signed) The PRESIDENT said that he should have to ask the opinion of the Council as to what course should be pursued. The chairman of the Committee (Mr. Turner) proposed to move the reception of his report. But then they must decide in what way they would deal with the notices of motion which followed on the programme-namely, those of Sir Dominic Corrigan, Dr. Andrew Wood, and Dr. Storrar. In addition to these, there was a notice of motion given by Dr. Bennett, and which was now in the printer's hands. This motion, like the motions of Sir Dominic Corrigan and Dr. Wood, was an alternative report, so that there were, in fact, three alternative reports claiming the attention of the Council. The motion of Dr. Storrar stood in a somewhat different category. It was not an alternative report, but it was definitely an amendment. Unless there was an objection to such a course, he would call at once upon the chairman of the Committee to move the reception of his report.

Dr. STORRAR wished it to be fairly understood that he should have the privilege of bringing forward his amendment before the report of the Committee was considered.

Sir DOMINIC CORRIGAN said that he must object to that course, as his own amendment came before that of Dr. Storrar on the programme.

The PRESIDENT said that he might be permitted to suggest that the fairest course would be that all three of the alternative reports should be treated in the same way as the original report as regards being received and entered on the minutes, as sooner or later they must be. He did not see how justice could be done to the several documents by any other course. Supposing that Dr. Storrar's amendment stood between the

original report and the alternative reports, the Council would then be discussing an amendment shelving the whole question without having had all the documents before them.

Dr. ANDREW WOOD said that he thought that the great point would be for them to have a debate upon the great general principle. It was a large question, and one not to be dealt with in a discussion upon this thing or that thing. Mr. Turner would propose the adoption of the report of the Committee, and then the fairest way of proceeding would be that Dr. Storrar should follow with his amendment, and for this reason that if Dr. Storrar, by any chance, which he (Dr.. Wood) thought was a very distant one, should carry his amendment, the whole thing would be at an end. The amendment of Dr. Storrar amounted to a refusal to consider the question, and if that was carried nothing further could be done. But if that amendment was thrown out, as it probably would be, then the next step would be to take Sir Dominic Corrigan's amendment, because he proposed a different course. His object was to delay a decisive answer until the licensing bodieswere consulted in regard to the great question. If that motion. was carried, the matter would be delayed for another year.. If, however, it was thrown out, then the next thing would be to take up the consideration of Mr. Turner's motion. His (Dr. Wood's) own motion was to a great extent the same, and. therefore he considered that his best course, to bring the whole thing before the Council, would be to move, in the form of amendments upon Professor Turner's report, those clauses which differed from that report. In that way the sense of the Council would be fully taken upon this very important

matter.

Dr. ROLLESTON said that he thought that, as a point of order, there could be no doubt that Dr. Storrar's notice of motion-to which he objected as strongly as anyone in the world-ought to take precedence of anything else, because if it should be carried it would save time. It said that the Council were not competent to discuss the matter. Therefore that point ought to be settled at the outset. The PRESIDENT said that he thought that his best course. would be to ask Mr. Turner to move his motion.

The following report was then presented by Mr. Turner.

Report.

The Committee having taken into consideration the letter of Mr. Simon, recommend the General Medical Council to adopt the following as the reply to be sent to the Lord President of the Privy Council:-(a.) In reply. to the communication addressed to them by the Lord President of the Privy Council, the Medical Council have to state that, being thus directly appealed to by the Lord President, they have felt bound to consider the question of the admission of women to the medical profession. (b.) After due deliberation, the Medical Council have to express their opinion that the study and practice of medicine and surgery, instead of affording a field of exertion well fitted for women, do, on the contrary, present special difficulties which cannot be safely ignored, and some of which cannot be obviated. (c.) Instead of medicine offering more facilities and less difficulties for women than other professions, the Medical Council believe, that as the whole question is looked into, there will be found peculiar hindrances, moral and physical, to the successful pursuit of medicine by women. Moreover, they desire to add that if it be admitted that women should enter the medical profession, the existence of an equal fitness in women for other professions must be assumed. (d.) If, notwithstanding such objections, it should appear to the Government and the Legislature expedient that women, who desire to obtain the legal status as medical practi tioners in this country, should not be debarred from obtaining that status, the Council recommend that it should be under some such conditions as the following:-1. That in the interests of public order the education and examinations of female students of medicine should be conducted entirely apart from those of males. 2. That, with regard to the "examination rules, or other conditions," which prevent women from obtaining a legal status as medical practitioners in this country, it would be sufficient if an Act of Parliament were passed which should enable the Medical Council to recognise the examinations of the licensing bodies under schedule (A) of the Medical Act, separately or conjointly, or such other examination or examinations as the Medical Council may, from time to time, deem sufficient, for the purpose of granting admission of women to the Medical Register under the title of "Licensed Practitioners of Medicine." 3. That the examinations of female candidates for a licence entitling their names to be placed on the Register, should be of the same character as those of males. 4. That the education and examinations for these licences should be under the supervision of the Medical Council in the same way as is required for the other licences of this country. (e.) As to other than mere legal difficulties which prevent women from accomplishing their wish to engage in the practice of medicine and surgery, the Council are of opinion that such difficulties must be overcome by private exertions, and that no special legislation is called for, except, perhaps, in the case of midwifery Moreover, the Council are of opinion that any course of legislation which would interfere with the free action of the universities and corporations mentioned in schedule (A), in respect of the medical education of women, is undesirable. (f.) In regard to Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill, the Council cannot approve of a measure intended to confer on women the privilege of registering certain foreign degrees, from which, under Clause 46 of the Medical Act, men are debarred, and over the education and examination for which the Medical Council have no means of exercising that supervision and control to which all the licensing bodies of this country, whether universities or medical corporations, are subjected. (9.) It is understood that there are women who would prefer to have a special qualification, and to be entered on a special register, recognising their competency to practise

midwifery. The Council believe that the education and examination of persons with such views will not be found to differ greatly, upon the whole, from those required of candidates for ordinary licences to practise. Nevertheless, women might be fit for registration on a special register, without passing an examination in various parts of surgery, and, indeed, of medicine. The decision of this question of a special register does not affect the question of admission of women to the General Register, but would require an alteration in schedule (D) of the Medical Act. (h.) It is right to observe that the Committee were not unanimous on some of the propositions in this report. WM. TURNER, Chairman.

Mr. TURNER said that his motion was, as the Council would observe, simply a proposal to receive the report and enter it on the minutes; but this might, nevertheless, be the right stage for him, as chairman of the Committee, to explain the report which they had handed in. The Committee had arrived at their conclusions with a due sense of their responsibility, and without haste. Several hours had been spent in a discussion on the two points raised in the letter. The first point related to the Bill introduced into Parliament to amend the Medical Act of 1858, so as to permit the registration of women who had taken a foreign degree of doctor of medicine. There could be no doubt that the consideration of this Bill fell within the legitimate province of this Council, for the registration of foreign degrees was specially referred to in one of the clauses of the Act under which the Council were constituted. The Committee came to a unanimous decision as to the answer which should be given to this part of the Lord President's letter. With reference to the more general question which was raised, there was naturally room for much greater difference of opinion than was found in connexion with the point relating to Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill. The opinion was expressed at the Committee that it was a subject not legitimately within the province of the Medical Council. Dr. Storrar had put a notice of motion to the same effect on the programme for this day. No doubt Dr. Storrar was technically correct in his view, but the question which the Committee had to consider was whether the Council should, by a merely technical objection, avoid giving the opinion which had been asked of them by an important department of the Government. He had heard complaints expressed to the effect that the Government did not sufficiently consult the Medical Council on various questions connected with the profession, and on which this Council might fairly be asked for an opinion. Certainly, if they refused to go into the present question, it was not at all likely that they would be ever again appealed to by the Government. On this ground, therefore, if on no other, it was important that they should endeavour to express some view as to the admission of women, whether that view was favourable or otherwise. Another preliminary question was raised in the Committee before they felt themselves prepared to go into the consideration of the general matter, and that question had been embodied in a motion, notice of which had been given by Sir Dominic Corrigan, whose idea was that the Council were not authorised to express any decided opinion without first submitting the matter to the consideration of the several licensing bodies, whose representatives they were. The Government, however, did not ask for the opinions of the various licensing bodies, but they asked for the opinion of this Council, and therefore they ought not to hesitate to express their opinion in the matter. The Committee having decided that they would take up the question, the next point for them to consider was what answer they should give as to whether women ought to be able to look to the medical profession as a means of livelihood. This was a more intricate matter, and naturally excited very great discussion. The Committee at last decided upon recommending the two following paragraphs:-" After due deliberation, the Medical Council have to express their opinion that the study and practice of medicine and surgery, instead of affording a field of exertion well fitted for women, do, on the contrary, present special difficulties which cannot be safely ignored, and some of which cannot be obviated.' "Instead of medicine offering more facilities and less difficulties for women than other professions, the Medical Council believe that as the whole question is looked into there will be found peculiar hindrances, moral and physical, to the successful pursuit of medicine by women. Moreover, they desire to add that if it be admitted that women should enter the medical professional, the existence of an equal fitness in women for other professions must be assumed." He might give one or two reasons why he agreed to the statements made in these two paragraphs, and in doing so he did not wish to commit any other member of the Committee to those reasons. He had no wish to say anything which might hurt the feel

ings of anyone, either man or woman. It would ill become him, whose domestic relations with the opposite sex had been all that could be desired throughout his life, to say one word which might be regarded as depreciating women. There were, however, certain general facts which could not be ignored in looking at this question. He had heard it argued that men and women were alike in capacity, and great ridicule had been cast upon those who asserted that woman had a distinctive sphere. He, however, looked upon such arguments as idle talk. No amount of special pleading could break down the physiological barrier which separated the two sexes from each other. They were not on a footing of equality, and they ought not to be rival claimants for the same object. He believed that it was a perfectly sound physiological doctrine that each sex had its own excellences, and one was the complement of the other. The physical framework and muscular apparatus of a woman were less powerful than those of a man. A woman's bones are more slender, and her skull exhibited a smaller amount of departure from the infantile condition than was found in a man. Her brain also was smaller and lighter. The average difference was as much as 10 per cent. in favour of the male. This was a fact of great significance, and the anatomical differences ought to find some physiological expression. The lower brain-weight implied a smaller capacity for concentration of thought, intellectual activity, and prolonged exertion, either mental or bodily. In woman the emotional qualities greatly preponderated over the logical. This preponderance was one of the most valuable characteristics of woman, and imparted those qualities which we valued so much in the wife and in the mother. It was also of the greatest importance in connexion with the function of a nurse, which she so often had to perform. The preponderance of the emotional qualities, however, ill adapted woman for a profession such as that of medicine, in which the exercise of the logical faculty was most desirable. He was not aware that the name of a woman occurred in connexion with the discovery of any leading scientific fact. He put forward these considerations as arguments in support of one of the statements contained in one of the paragraphs of the report-that there were peculiar hindrances, moral and physical, to the successful pursuit of medicine by women. He would admit that there were men in the medical profession who were sadly behindhand in the appreciation of all that was necessary in connexion with the study of disease; but he doubted whether the introduction of women would raise the standard. The expression that the fitness of women for other professions must be assumed, was inserted by the Committee in consequence of the medical profession having been made a battle-ground upon which should be fought out the question of the equality of the two sexes, which had come prominently forward in recent years. It would be seen that they had many weighty objections to recommend to the Lord President in regard to the introduction of women into the profession; but still the Committee felt that if the Government decided to give facilities to women for entering the profession, it would be seemly to indicate how this might be done, and to lay down certain propositions or conditions which ought to be carried out in connexion with the matter. He felt that it was very important that nothing should be done to interfere with the free action of the corporations in this respect. The plan had, therefore, been suggested for the consideration of the Privy Council. The last sentence in the report bore upon the question of a special register in connexion with the recognising the competency of women to practise in midwifery. It embodied very much the spirit of the report of the Committee presented to the Council in the year 1873. It was with especial reference to that report that the last paragraph was inserted in the present report. Mr. Turner concluded by moving the reception and entry of the report.

The motion was seconded by Sir WILLIAM GULL, and carried unanimously.

Mr. TURNER then moved- "That the Medical Council approve of the report of the Committee on Mr. Simon's letter."

Sir WILLIAM GULL seconded the motion.

Dr. ANDREW WOOD recommended that the clauses of the report be considered seriatim.

Upon this suggestion the motion was withdrawn, and Mr. TURNER moved in substitution-" That the Council resolve itself into a committee to consider the report on Mr. Simon's letter, paragraph by paragraph."

This motion also was seconded by Sir WILLIAM GULL.

Dr. STORRAR moved as an amendment-"That the duties to which the General Medical Council are appointed are defined by the Medical Acts, and the Council are of opinion that their appointments do not authorise them to represent to the Government the views of the profession on the large social question of the expediency or otherwise of admitting women to practise medicine." He said that his opposition to the report did not arise from any essential difference from Professor Turner as to the proper function of women, but from a difference of opinion as to the expediency of the Council taking up this question at all. The Medical Council was a corporate body, acting under a common seal for definite purposes. Those definite purposes, according to the Acts of Parliament, were the charge of the Medical Register, the supervision of medical education, and the compilation of a British Pharmacopoeia; and he apprehended that they had no authority to discuss questions outside the area of these matters. The medical bodies who were represented by the members of the Council, reserved to themselves the duty of deciding upon questions which were not within the scope of the medical Acts. To take an instance from his own case he was the representative of the University of London, the Senate of which had decided that they would not take any steps to enable them to confer degrees upon women. The members of the Senate might, therefore, fairly turn round upon him if he favoured the discussion of this subject, and ask him what right he had to take a share in arriving at a conclusion which might possibly be different from that at which they had themselves arrived. It was on that ground that he opposed the motion. As a Council they were not there to fire at every object which might be thrown up in the air. Nothing could be more distinct than the duties assigned to them under the Acts relating to the Council. But it seemed that some of the members of the Council were impressed with the honour of the distinction which had been conferred upon them by the Lord President in referring the present question to them. For his own part, he did not entertain so strong an impression of this distinction, for he could not help recollecting all that had transpired in past years between the Privy Council and this body. He would merely refer to the time when they were discussing a Medical Bill which the Privy Council undertook to carry through Parliament, and which, after it had passed the House of Lords, was withdrawn in the House of Commons. The Privy Council had shown a disposition on every occasion to push them aside. Two years ago a deputation from the Medical Council waited upon the Marquis of Ripon, who was then the Lord President, to ascertain whether he was prepared to introduce a Medical Bill, and, after being with him for about an hour, they knew no more of his intentions than they knew before the interview. Such difficulties had spread over a series of years, and had been experienced during successive Governments. Whoever had been at the head of the Privy Council, all the communications which had been made to the Medical Council had passed through the same channel of communication. Whatever the source of authority, the letters had always been signed "John Simon," and it was impossible not to see that the views of the Government had received peculiar expression in passing through that channel. In whose soever hand the department had been, they could see that, though the hand was Esau's, the voice was Jacob's voice. Instead of looking upon the reference of this question to the Medical Council as conferring an honour upon them, he regarded it rather as a Trojan horse. It contained the elements of destruction, and he could very well conceive all the persons in the Privy Council saying among themselves, "What are we to do with this Bill of Mr. Cowper-Temple? Nobody seems to have very definite ideas about it. It will be a very nice bone of contention to send down to the Medical Council. Let them worry over it for a few days." The Council had worried over it, and they had got no fewer than three reports out of a very small Committee. If the Council once got into the entanglement of a discussion on this great social question, with which, in his opinion, they had nothing to do, they would find themselves at loggerheads with the bodies whom they represented, and they would be asked by those bodies what right they had to exercise a function which was not assigned to them by the Medical Acts. He confessed that he could not defend himself in an event of that kind. As regards the main question, if they decided in favour of the admission of women, they would have a large number of persons finding fault, and laughing at them, and telling them that they were interfering with matters with which they had no concern. On the other hand, if they decided against the women, it would be said, as had been said

already, "Of course you decide against the women, because you are a trade's union." From the commencement of the year 1858 to the present year they had kept clear of these subjects, but they had never questioned the right of women to be registered if they produced the certificates of any of the bodies whom the Council were authorised to recognise. The names of Rhoda Garrett Anderson and Miss Blackwell were already on the Register. He did not call into question the propriety of the Privy Council appealing to the Medical Council on the question of the registration of foreign degrees. That was a question regarding which a good deal might be said, apart altogether from the question of registering women under those degrees.

Dr. PARKES said he thought that Dr. Storrar's remarks about the Marquis of Ripon were somewhat unfair to a nobleman who had taken the greatest possible trouble with regard to the Medical Acts. He then called attention to the report of the deputation upon the minutes of the Council. The passage referred to was read from the minutes of 1873. The report said that though his lordship was favourable to the introduction, by some private member, of a measure removing any legal difficulties which might exist, preventing the Council from carrying out Clause 19 of the Medical Act, such a step must not be regarded as precluding his consideration of a larger measure, if he thought it desirable on a future occasion.

Dr. STORRAR: Precisely so. He simply said, "Take what course you please, and I shall reserve to myself the right of opposing or supporting." Thus it amounted to absolutely nothing.

Dr. THOMSON seconded the amendment. It was not his intention to offer any observations upon the wide question which threatened to come before the Council, but he would merely explain the grounds upon which he seconded Dr. Storrar's motion. He thought that it was altogether beyond the province of the Council to express, either for themselves, or, as it might appear, for the profession at large, any opinion upon this subject. The admission of women to practice was a subject which could be settled only by the licensing bodies or by the Government, but he did not pretend to say by which. At the same time, the utmost courtesy ought to be shown both to the Lord President and to Mr. Simon in any answer which was given to the Privy Council; and that part of the inquiry which related to the registration of foreign degrees must be dealt with.

Dr. ROLLESTON said that he had listened with great pleasure to what Dr. Thomson had said, for he had taken a large view of this matter. If it could not be settled by the licensing bodies, it must be settled by the Legislature. Since 1858 the licensing bodies had taken no step whatever, but ever since that year public opinion had been declaring itself, not only by most able writers, who, according to the custom of this country, wrote anonymously, but also by others who had forced their names upon the public, and through the public upon the Legislature. The sort of reasoning with which they had now to deal was that contained in Mr. Mill's book on the subjection of women, which was one of the wisest and best books he had ever written. That was the kind of reasoning which influenced the Legislature; and was the Legislature going to act without advice? If not, would it take the advice of these clever writers? or, as Sir William Gull had suggested to him (Dr. Rolleston), would the Legislature come for counsel to the Council? It wished to get advice from the very best source, and in that respect it was acting with more wisdom than some other Governments had done. He cared comparatively little whether the Government said "yes" or "no" to the question whether a couple of dozen females should have what some people call "justice done to them, but he maintained that it would be a slur upon the Council if it failed to consider the question, and to give its opinion respecting it. With reference to what Dr. Storrar had said, he (the speaker) used to think that the older universities had practised the art of "how not to do it," but they had rather dropped that art during the last ten or twelve years.

Dr. STORRAR: So it seems.

Dr. ROLLESTON would remind the members of the University of London that they owed their raison d'être to the way in which the older universities had practised that art. They refused to do justice to one-half of the males of this country -namely, the Dissenters; and the result was that the London University was established. Now some persons were refusing to do justice to one-half of the human species.

Whether the London University chose to follow the example set by the older universities a generation ago, and "not do it," or to follow the example which he believed the older ones would now set, and do it," it would make no difference; but it was a serious matter to enter upon this line of not doing things, unless what was proposed had something absolutely wrong about it. Holding their tongue when they were asked to speak was one of the very worst things they could possibly do. If the older universities had not studied that art, he was sure there would not have been a representative of the London University now present at the Council board; for there would have been no London University in existence had it not been for the older universities refusing to do justice to the Dissenters. If the representatives of the London University who were sent to the Council were tied down in the way suggested by Dr. Storrar, they could scarcely be called representatives, but must rather be regarded as delegates.

He was

Dr. STORRAR denied that he was a delegate. elected to exercise his judgment upon matters which formed the proper function of the Council, but he had no right to deal with any other subjects.

Dr. ROLLESTON could not agree with Dr. Storrar in his view of the limit of his duties. He would say that their motto ought to be, not " Strike, but hear," but "Strike, but answer." The question of the admission of women had been tried elsewhere. We had had such persons as Queen Elizabeth and Queen Caroline; he meant the first, not the second. And now we had at this time Queen Victoria on the throne of this country. Nevertheless, women were totally unfit! Their brains were smaller (Professor Turner had omitted to add that their bodies also were smaller) than those of men. We knew that there was a good deal of relation between the size of the body and the size of the brain. Though they might say all this, let them not run away from their duty, but take for their motto that of a fine classical novel, "Adsum cave!"

Dr. THOMSON added, in consequence of what had fallen from the last speaker, that he did not wish to be understood as having expressed any opinion one way or the other upon the general question. That would remain for the future.

Sir WILLIAM GULL said that he thought that the whole of Dr. Storrar's argument fell to the ground, when he (Sir William) considered why he himself, together with Dr. Stokes, Dr. Sharpey, Dr. Parkes, and Dr. Quain, formed part of that Council. Whence had they got their authority? If they had none, then had Dr. Storrar himself got any? This consideration seemed to cut away all the ground from under Dr. Storrar.

Dr. STORRAR: You have no power beyond ours.

Sir WILLIAM GULL said that that was what he wished to be understood, but he wanted Dr. Storrar to take a larger view of his own powers. The fault which he had committed was that he had taken a too narrow view. According to that view, as Dr. Rolleston had said, Dr. Storrar was rather a delegate than a representative. He (Sir William) could not take the position of a delegate, for he had nobody to delegate him except the whole country. What defined his duty defined that of Dr. Storrar. They came there to give counsel to the whole country with reference to medicine and medical practice. He was not sent there merely to act the part of a policeman, which any tolerably respectable man receiving £3 a week could do as well, and perhaps a great deal better. The Government had taken him from his important duties-to do what? Not to do next to nothing. The preamble of the Medical Act said: "Whereas, it is expedient that persons requiring medical advice should be enabled to distinguish qualified from unqualified persons." The Register was only subordinate to that end; and it was for the Council to consider what the Register should include.

Dr. STORRAR: The schedule tells you that.

Sir WILLIAM GULL thought that it was within the province of the Council to determine what should be the extent of the Register, and the conditions under which people should be put upon it. That took in the whole question whether it was expedient that women should look to medical practice as a means of livelihood. The duty of the Council was to help the public to determine who were fit persons to be consulted; and if the public said, "We wish to consult women," the Council were bound to say under what conditions women might be consulted safely. What was the meaning of the word "council"? Surely it implied some function beyond looking after the Register. Dr. Storrar had said that the Government had not treated the Council well. Then let the Council give

the Government good for evil, and be ready to offer them their best services in the best way they could render them. They would then be treated better by the Government in future. Dr. Storrar had remarked that the letter had come from Mr. Simon. Well, let it be taken quantum valeat. For his own part, he had an intense personal respect for Mr. Simon. Dr. STORRAR; So have I.

Sir WILLIAM GULL, continuing, said that he did not know why Mr. Simon's name should have been introduced. They were bound to consider the letter as coming from the Privy Council. The Lord President had that day told him (Sir William) that he was much interested in this matter, and that he should be happy to confer with the Medical Council at any time that they might desire. This was not a corporate question at all. It had been said that they ought to inquire what the profession had to say. Did any man pretend that he did not know what the profession would say? And how could the voice of the profession be got at better than it was known at present? The whole thing had been discussed in the journals, and talked of on all occasions. If the Council was a representative Council of the whole profession, whose business was not limited to the keeping of the Register, but included the fulfilment of a large and important duty, let its members help the Government and the public in the best way they could. Dr. QUAIN said that they had to deal with a question of law and a question of expediency. By law they had no right to express any opinion such as was asked of them. ("No, no.") Their duty was to carry out the Act of Parliament. He agreed with every word which Dr. Storrar had said, but should be obliged to vote against him because he deemed it expedient to give a suitable answer to the question which had been put to them by the Government.

He

Dr. ANDREW WOOD said that he should vote against Dr. Storrar's amendment because he disagreed with every word which Dr. Storrar had said. He held that they were not sent there as the delegates of any corporations, and he would not sit there in that capacity. When his college appointed him to come to the Council they left him at perfect liberty to deliberate upon all matters coming before the Council, and, if they were not pleased with the way in which he did that, they could turn him out. He believed the Council to be a representative body, and, if it was so, what did it represent unless it was the medical profession? They were all medical men sent in the interests of the public, in order that the public might get the best medical aid that could be got. was astonished that a slur should be thrown upon the Government because it had come with courtesy and asked for advice. When the Duke of Richmond, who was most anxious to do what was right, asked their opinion, why should they not give him an answer? The Duke of Richmond might ask the opinion of anybody he chose, but he naturally looked upon this Council as the body from whom he might hope to get the best advice. Would they say to him that they must decline to give advice because it was not within the clauses of the Medical Act that they should advise the Privy Council upon the medical education of women? The medical profession was threatened with a revolution in the form of the introduction of women into it, and, when it had been pressed upon the Government that they should take up this question, they were anxious to get the best advice on the subject. If the Council adopted the amendment they would lose an amount of influence which could never be restored.

Sir DOMINIC CORRIGAN said that he agreed with Dr. Storrar that they were not authorised to take up this question, but he would not go so far as Dr. Storrar, and say that they never could take it up. For himself, he felt that he was not justified in deciding on so important a question, without going back and consulting his constituents as to their opinions upon it. Therefore what he would suggest was that the settlement of the question should be delayed until time had been afforded for them to take that course. Technically speaking, Dr. Wood was incorrect in saying that they were representatives of the medical profession. They were, in fact, representatives of the nineteen licensing bodies who had sent them; and there was a wide difference between the two things. There had been a struggle coming on for many years between the British Medical Association and the Medical Council, with regard to getting admission to this Board. He did not want to take one side or the other, but he contended that technically they were not representatives of the profession.

Mr. MACNAMARA said that Clause 18 enabled the Council to take into consideration generally the requisites for obtaining

qualifications. That seemed to entitle them to take into consideration whether being of the male or female sex was requisite for the licence.

Dr. SHARPEY said that he had heard with some pain the introduction of the word "delegates," as applied to the members of that body. He had had the pleasure of sitting on the Council for many years with Dr. Storrar, and the whole tenor of the conduct and proceedings of that gentleman had been anything but that of a mere delegate. Dr. Storrar was mistaken in supposing that their function was restricted to carrying the Medical Act into effect. They had, in fact, often been called upon to propose amendments to that Act. The technical objection of Dr. Storrar was not sufficient. Independently of the question of expediency, they were quite competent to give an answer to the Government on this subject.

The amendment was put to the meeting and lost, a large majority voting against it.

Sir DOMINIC CORRIGAN then proceeded to move the amendment which stood in his name, and which contained a different form of answer to the letter from the Privy Council. He said that there would not be a second opinion upon the Council as to the answer which should be returned on the subject of Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill, for that Bill would admit upon the Register the names of women who held the degrees of foreign universities, over whose course of education and examination the Medical Council had no control, while men were denied the privilege of having those degrees recognised. That part of his proposed answer which related to Mr. Cowper-Temple's Bill coincided with the reply in the report of the Committee, and with what he believed to be the views of the Council. The next part of the letter of Mr. Simon put the question whether women were to be admitted to general practice, and then whether they were to be admitted to certain branches of practice. He did not think that the last point had been sufficiently dwelt on in the report of the Committee. Then, in the last part of the letter the writer went on to inquire what were the conditions with regard to examination-rules or other matters which prevented women from obtaining a legal status as medical practitioners in this country. The letter simply asked for information on that point, but the report of the Committee passed it by, and, instead of affording information as to the present obstacles, it laid down a plan for the Government by which women could obtain admission on the Register. The Lord President asked one question, and the reply of the Committee answered another. This formed a very serious objection to the answer which was proposed by the Committee. The Committee went on to say that in dealing with the letter of the Lord President they felt bound to consider the question of the admission of women. He himself felt bound to consider it, but he was not bound to consider it upon such short notice as twenty-four hours, without consulting the University which he had the honour to represent. Dr. Wood had said that they ought to give an answer immediately, but he (Sir Dominic) could not think that the Lord President would wish to hurry them in a decision upon so important a matter. The report then went on to say that there were difficulties in the way of the admission of women which could not be obviated; and it submitted a plan by which that admission might be made possible. It would have been more manly, independent, and straightforward, if they felt that there were difficulties which could not be safely ignored, and some of which could not be obviated, to decline being made a party to any compromise which would admit women into the profession. The scheme proposed by the Committee, for giving to the Government information for which it had not asked, would have the effect of making three or four examining bodies in addition to those which already existed, while for years the Council had been working to promote a conjoint scheme. They would therefore be blowing hot and cold in that respect if they adopted the proposal of the Committee. Sir Dominic went on to criticise various other portions of the report, and expressed the opinion that the document was not one worthy to be sent to the Lord President, and that it could not be altered so as to make it so. His own form of reply dealt with the questions alluded to in the letter of Mr. Simon. The allusion to "special branches of surgery" which might be practised by women, he supposed referred to midwifery. On this point he held that the Council ought to prevent midwifery licences being granted, except by the legitimate corporations. As to the settlement of the general question, there would not be

any real delay if the matter were deferred for a year while the opinion of the licensing bodies on the subject was obtained. If that course was adopted, he should have no objection to withdraw his amendment.

Dr. AQUILLA SMITH seconded the amendment. He said that it differed very materially from that of Dr. Storrar, because it did not ignore the question, and did not take from the Council the power of considering it. He concurred with the opinion that it was the bounden duty of this Council, when it was. honoured by a communication from the Privy Council, to entertain the question and return a becoming answer. He also supported the amendment on the ground that it would supersede the report. The report of the Committee pointed out, in clear and strong language, the incapacity of women to compete with men in the medical profession, and yet in the latter part it suggested that an Act of Parliament should be passed to introduce women into that profession. The report appeared to contain such contradictions that he could not give his sanction to it. He also objected to the recommendation that the examinations of female candidates should be in all cases the same as those of males. He would ask those persons who were teachers whether they would feel themselves warranted in going into the very important and wide subject of syphilis and all its consequences? He had reason to know that there was one lady who had come into practice who would not shrink from the inquiry into syphilis in its most revolting forms. This would occasion a difficulty. This subject had never been brought under the notice of the body which he represented,. and he should not feel warranted to state an opinion that females should be admitted according to the suggestions of the report.

Dr. ANDREW WOOD wished to recall the Council to the question which was raised by the amendment. The real point to be decided at the present moment was, whether they should go on to consider the whole question at once, or whether they should tell the Privy Council that they were not prepared to entertain it until they had ascertained the views of the licensing bodies upon it. On that point there might be a difference of opinion, though the question certainly was not a new one. Indeed, nothing had excited so much attention for many years as this subject of female doctors; and he, therefore, held that to tell the Privy Council that they had not had time to consider a question which, in fact, they had been considering for years, would be a great stultification.

ment.

Sir WILLIAM GULL said that this was not in the least a question for the corporations or the universities, but it was a question for the public, the Medical Council, and the GovernThe report particularly stated that the corporations. and universities should be left free, and it deprecated any interference with their system. To send the question to the corporations would be to admit that the Council consisted only of the nominees and representatives of different bodies. A vote was taken upon the amendment, and it was negatived.

Dr. ANDREW WOOD said that he should not at present intervene between the Council and the Committee by proposing the amendment which he had put upon the programme.

After a little further discussion, the motion for going into committee on the report was agreed to.

The consideration of the reply proposed by the Committee as that which should be sent to the Lord President was then commenced. Much time was occupied in making slight verbal alterations and in the comparison of certain paragraphs with corresponding passages of the alternative replies.

Mr. TURNER moved, and Sir WILLIAM GULL seconded, the adoption of the following paragraphs (a, b, c) as corrected :"(a.) In reply to the communication addressed to them by the Lord President, the Medical Council have to state that, being thus directly appealed to by the Lord President, they have felt bound to consider the question of the admission of women to the medical profession. (b.) After due deliberation, the Medical Council have to express their opinion that the study and practice of medicine and surgery, instead of affording a field of exertion well fitted for women, do, on the contrary, present special difficulties, which cannot be safely ignored, and some of which cannot be obviated. (c.) Instead of medicine offering more facilities and less difficulties for women than other professions, the Medical Council believe, that as the whole question is looked into, there will be found peculiar hindrances, moral and physical, to the successful pursuit of medicine by women. Moreover, they desire to add that if it be admitted that women should enter the medical profession,